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/ic/ Guide To Improving Visual Imagination

OP Thu 29 Apr 08:49:35 2021 No.5364887 View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>5365230 >>5365255 >>5365268 >>5365334 >>5365377 >>5365721 >>5366734

I wanted to make a guide on improving visual imagination because it came to my attention that no such guide existed. If you would like to read it it is located here:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BKyhc0poh6OhTBRz3ONQQAv3HfY-s-DbOFW-mn1CWNk/edit?usp=sharing

It is open to comments, and I would love some feedback.

Your visual abilities are improvable through hard work. Over the last couple of years I have cultivated this ability through the steps I gave in my document, and I have seen impressive results.

If you would like to link additional information to me, I would love to see it. Books or articles on the subject are hard to come by. Here are some from previous threads:

https://archive.org/details/drawingfrommemor00cavm
https://archive.org/details/133_20200605

Feel free to leave if you are not interested, but it took me a while to make so some feedback would be lovely.

Check out my previous thread (it’s been a while):
https://warosu.org/ic/thread/S5225037#p5225037

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 08:57:42 No.5364903 Report

Quoted By:

Shintaro kago is goat

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 09:40:35 No.5364952 Report

Quoted By: >>5364967

dont do this, it creates tulpas

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 09:48:17 No.5364966 Report

Quoted By: >>5364971

Summarize your core arguments

OP Thu 29 Apr 2021 09:49:33 No.5364967 Report

Quoted By:

>>5364952
I talked about this on the first thread I ever made for this, but that's why I stress a lack of emotional attachment to your imagination. Frankly, I would prefer if the concept would be ignored and kept away from what is a very legitimate process, as it is a cesspool for delusion and delegitimizes the entire concept of memory drawing.

OP Thu 29 Apr 2021 09:51:31 No.5364971 Report

Quoted By:

>>5364966
tldr read the first paragraph of the exercises in the document and the bolded text.

Located here:

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BKyhc0poh6OhTBRz3ONQQAv3HfY-s-DbOFW-mn1CWNk/edit?usp=sharing

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 13:30:07 No.5365190 Report

Quoted By:

I have aphantasia

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 14:10:08 No.5365221 Report

Quoted By: >>5365277

Fuck me man I don't have complete aphantasia so I always have this little bit of hope that I can improve my visualisation.
I can Imagine sound extremely well. I can listen to songs in my head almost as if they are really playing,
just in my "minds ear". But my minds eye, that's another story.
I can't believe that it could be as good as my minds ear or even tounge.
Also this miming you wrote about, I can do that super well too. I can use my "head hands" to touch whatever I want.
It's like I traded my minds eyes to make all my other imaginary senses stronger.
I would love to train the eye I traded in to cheat the system so to speak

I have a hard time believing that simply using that bit of imagination I have trains it.
How long should I try before giving up?
Even if it just ends up enabling me to see the cube clearer than now I think I'll try it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 14:22:51 No.5365230 Report

Quoted By: >>5365604

>>5364887
That's quite a nifty idea, I'll start giving it a whirl and see how I go. Appreciate the work mate!

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 14:41:04 No.5365255 Report

Quoted By: >>5365604

>>5364887
pyw

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 14:55:16 No.5365268 Report

Quoted By:

>>5364887
Lol post your imaginations before I bother reading this shit

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 14:59:12 No.5365277 Report

Quoted By: >>5365373

>>5365221
>It's like I traded my minds eyes to make all my other imaginary senses stronger
It is probably the case. From what I've read we only have this much neurons in the brain so they kind of have to compete. By the way are you musician? If so why would you choose art over music?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 15:37:49 No.5365334 Report

Quoted By:

>>5364887
neat, thanks OP

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 16:21:03 No.5365373 Report

Quoted By:

>>5365277
I made some electronic music. I'd say I'm high beg there but I havent made anything in over a year.
I can always Imagine what I want my music to sound like but I don't have the technical knowledge
to make the synth sound the way I want them to and it's a pretty unintuitive and for me not fun skill to grind.
Creating souds feels like mixing colors but you can only look at the colors to mix once before being blindfolded.
I know what color I want and I know what base colors I have but I cant see clearly how to mix them
or how they interact with each other.
I do enjoy is mixing and mastering though and doing it professionally would be my dream career.

I also rap and took part in some online battles but I hate my high, girly voice so fucking much.
I know you can sound good with a high voice but I haven't figured out how to lean into it properly.
It's a shame because I'm usually pretty happy with my lyrics.
But when I write I imagine a deeper voice singing it and after clearly hearing my imagined version for so long
I get dissapointed once I start recording.

When I was a child I drew hundereds of comics. I took 2 or more a4 papers, folded them twice, stapeled them, cut the edges off
and then I had nice books to draw in. Because I drew so much
I was always ahead of others when it came to drawing but I was never amazing like one of those taiwanese 7 year old wonderkids.
In 3rd grade I impressed the others when I could draw 3d boxes for example.
The main reason I was impressive is basically that most people absolutely suck.
So I enjoy drawing and I built a good foundation and motorskills in my childhood so I dont want to waste it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 16:23:47 No.5365377 Report

Quoted By:

>>5364887
When I visualize things in my head I'm almost always using "gestures", roughly similar to the directions you'd move your hands in while drawing, not just when drawing individual lines but also when adding color or detail. It kind of helps but I also find it somewhat limiting sometimes to rely on it so much.
I've always assumed it's normal for people who developed visual imagination hand-in-hand with learning to actually draw, but I've also realized that these kind of things vary a lot between different people. So does anyone else here do this?

Also, fun fact, I remember that a long time ago, when I was 10 or something like that, I was testing my visual imagination similar to this, but I'd have a really hard time imagining static things in some cases. For example, I remember distinctly trying to imagine a guy walking on a wire, but I couldn't hold him on the wire more than a couple seconds, then he'd start either falling or spinning around the wire with his feet stuck to it.

There's probably some lesson to learn from this as well, such that the natural building blocks of the brain's imagination are moving physical objects and not just static images. Similar how it's fairly easy to imagine a boulder rolling down a hill, but if you do, you're not really thinking of how the boulder looks at every instant while it's rotating and bumping. The idea of a rigid object is its own concept, and the brain does not really rely on the visual perception you have of it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 16:30:05 No.5365388 Report

Quoted By:

this is awesome I could totally see this as an NFT being sold for a lot. I heard about marketplaces like mogulcoin.io for good ways to sell these NFTs

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 29 Apr 2021 16:54:58 No.5365411 Report

Quoted By: >>5365604

No, i won't read that shit unless you pyw

OP Thu 29 Apr 2021 18:56:23 No.5365604 Report

Quoted By:

>>5365230
Thanks (:

>>5365411
>>5365255
I'm not really all that good as an artist. It's frustrating because I wish the skills would transfer more to each other, but memory drawing and drawing are different skills entirely. I am hoping that in a few years I will be able to truly make a product that I want people to see, but for right now I'm still playing catch up. Sorry.

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OP Thu 29 Apr 2021 20:09:38 No.5365721 Report

Quoted By:

>>5364887

I made a poll to get a judge of how difficult the first exercise is for people. It took me months to get good at this and I am wondering where other people are at in the process.

This document contains the first exercise I am talking about:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1BKyhc0poh6OhTBRz3ONQQAv3HfY-s-DbOFW-mn1CWNk/edit?usp=sharing

Here is the poll:
http://www.strawpoll.me/42688459

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 30 Apr 2021 09:34:03 No.5366734 Report

Quoted By:

>>5364887
I do this but with bobs and vagene

I'm up to 10 pairs of bobs

bobs inside vagene is easy
vagene inside bob is hard
stacking vagenes is very hard
vagenes on a grid in space is easy now, I used the mograph cloner in my mind

I haven't used any colors yet and transparency can get very confusing and frys my brain and makes me tired

good guide, thanks for posting

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 30 Apr 2021 14:06:27 No.5366985 Report

Quoted By:

I thought of another good analogy to describe how bad my minds eyes quality is. It's like looking at a phone screen with the lowest brightness setting in broad daylight. You can see that there's stuff there but you the colors are barely there and the reflections prevent you from seeing the whole image.

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Anonymous Fri 30 Apr 2021 23:05:52 No.5367658 Report

Quoted By: >>5367661 >>5367729

What's your opinion on gestural approach to interior or still life drawing? Could it enhance your perception and help you feel the space around you better? Here's an example of what I'm talking about https://youtu.be/L5FGPby_BNU
It's not completely deviod of measurements though but that's not the point

Anonymous

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Anonymous Fri 30 Apr 2021 23:08:28 No.5367661 Report

Quoted By: >>5367729

>>5367658

OP Fri 30 Apr 2021 23:57:43 No.5367729 Report

Quoted By:

>>5367658
>>5367661
I do think that it could help you feel the space better. If it can challenge you then go for it. A lot of what I write about is me talking from my butt, but one of the axioms I follow is that if you're challenging yourself and you can feel improvement then that's what matters. The method is less important than the time commitment. That being said, if the method is not challenging you then don't go for it.

I feel like you could also easily tie it into memory drawing techniques like the Boisbaudran formula they talk about in this book:

https://archive.org/details/133_20200605/022.jpg

The whole process of memorizing gestures or shapes in a scene before adding detail, I think, has some interesting parallels.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 01 May 2021 05:06:07 No.5368180 Report

Quoted By: >>5368202

I'm upset you're not posting your work OP but I gave Exercise 1 a try anyway. I was pleasantly surprused at how much concentration I had to give to do it. Not sure how this will translate into drawing ability, but I will use definitely this technique when I need to clear my mind.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 01 May 2021 05:23:53 No.5368202 Report

Quoted By:

>>5368180
I'm glad you see the merit in it. Sorry for not posting my work. If I'm ever happy with something I'll consider posting it, but for the time being I'm still very much a beginner in art. Visualization and drawing ability are very different skills.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 02 May 2021 12:51:03 No.5370198 Report

Quoted By:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9tcy2436iM

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 02 May 2021 14:16:24 No.5370297 Report

Quoted By: >>5370603

Inserting read, I have a super great imagination and all the exercise are a breeze for me, since I will imagine for 8+ hours a day, so that might be why. But I can't draw for shit. All my art is schizo tier abstractions. I think it because I make "movies" instead of still scenes. I can visualize a entire world and "live" in it. I can do this when I do simple things, like walking, shopping, working, ect. So try to visualize when you are aware and about in the world. I think that this will help you a lot because you can be in this realm and your minds eye at the same time. It hurts my heart that its hard for people to imagine simple things, I wonder how this came about.

OP Sun 02 May 2021 18:07:58 No.5370603 Report

Quoted By: >>5370882

>>5370297
What's your process like? Is it any similar to mine?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 02 May 2021 21:50:01 No.5370882 Report

Quoted By: >>5370980

>>5370603
Yes, but when I visualize I usually create a story along with it, since I write way more than I draw. I think writing and creating a story would hone your imagination a more. Because after I began to write my imagination story pacing increased ten fold. Because everyone loves stories and live stories. But I didn't have to concrete though or close my eyes, it just came on the fly. I usually start with a character and build the environment second.

Like, a zombie farmer buying ice cream at the 7/11 at 2 in the morning but he ran out of cash so he is trying to barter with the Indian clerk who is to busy asking for feet pics from whores on tinder. So he gets frustrated and runs out but since he is a rotting corpse his legs crumble and rats swarm him like kenny from south park.

I thought and imagine this on the fly, without thinking. I think in the writing world they call "stream of consciousness" writing. Were you set a timer and write and don't think. I think that this will help too. In some threads on Aphantasia, I think anons are overthinking and are fearful that they have it, so they inhibit their imagination. Also I sense a victim hood complex in some of the posts that I read.

Also I've mime as well, and did your exercises too. Mediation will help too, same with reading fiction. I also tend to imagination best when I'm listen to music, but I can't write music at all though, nor draw well. I can automatic draw with ease, I will tend to do that when Im doing figures or any study. Most here would call my art schizophrenic.

OP Sun 02 May 2021 23:13:19 No.5370980 Report

Quoted By:

>>5370882
Sounds quite similar to how I do things. I don't usually sit and fry my brain on cubes very often. I just did that at first to build my concentration and control and what you do sounds a lot like what I do when I don't sweat it as much. The stream of consciousness story writing sounds like it could be fun. I'll have to try that some time.

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