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The abysmal quality of papers outside of US and UK

Anonymous Wed 17 Jul 16:16:26 2019 No.10814688 View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>10814693 >>10814694 >>10814704 >>10814754

Ok I am currently a graduate school in economics and skimming through a lot of papers from all around the world. The one thing I notice is that discrepancy of quality of papers between US, UK and other countries is surprisingly large. Even when I search the thesis from countries like Germany , France and Japan, it looks like a meme paper done by incompetent master students. Hell if you look at 2nd, 3nd world countries like Turkey, Russia and India, the papers might be written by undergrads. It could be only in economics, but do you guys observe this trend in your fields?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 17 Jul 2019 16:19:12 No.10814693 Report

Quoted By:

>>10814688
What is wrong with the papers, pindos?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 17 Jul 2019 16:19:40 No.10814694 Report

Quoted By: >>10814710 >>10814754 >>10814819

>>10814688
I usually just go by whether the author has a white sounding name

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 17 Jul 2019 16:24:25 No.10814704 Report

Quoted By: >>10814819 >>10816316

>>10814688
Yes, in engineering. Most Europeans graduate without even having published a single journal article. They gyppo over the Bolonga process by publishing 3 "In proceedings" papers, ie peer reviewed short papers presented at conferences. These have an abysmal standard because a conference paper doesn't even need to be correct, just relevant to the topic. They pass peer review in a day or two.

Here's the kicker though. The EU actually thinks they have better degrees than America. They usually demand GREs etc. even from Caltech graduates if you're applying to their institutes. They are pretty elitist in general and you'll find a lot of journals called "European journal of _" with high impact, but the actual articles are often self perpetuating garbage.

Not to say that there isn't shit work done at top American unis, but it is a completely different standard for graduating.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 17 Jul 2019 16:25:27 No.10814710 Report

Quoted By: >>10814819

>>10814694
This. Even third worlder's in Brazil etc produce good work if they have white christian names.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 17 Jul 2019 16:45:43 No.10814754 Report

Quoted By:

>>10814688
My personal impression is that it depends heavily not only on the uni, but on the actual chair the thesis emerges from. I found this to be true for my own uni and wondered if it was true for others, so whenever I found a good paper I started scrolling over a couple of others from the same chair and a couple ones from other chairs of the same uni. It seems pretty much consistent all over the world, with US, UK and Swiss unis having an usually high percentage of "good chairs" and everything from the mdidle East Asia (exception: Japan) having bad to abysmal ones. Then there's a few other central European unis which are very good, but not representative of their country's standard.
(In fairness: I didn't spend my life on this. I looked only at unis I found papers from when I was looking for papers on projects, not specifically to compare, and the US, UK and Asian papers you find are usually from the better unis there as well, so all of this is very subjective.)

>>10814694
I sometimes saw this on the "outliers" (people producing good work with everything else from their chair being dogshit), but chair seems to be the dominant feature. I.e. also papers from strange sounding names tend to be good if their chair is good.

Another thing I find is that papers are generally much better and much more comparable than theses, which are mostly horrifyingly bad if I have to be honest. Like, I'm frequently appalled by the work people receive degrees for.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 17 Jul 2019 16:59:39 No.10814777 Report

Quoted By: >>10814785

I wrote my Master's thesis 8 years ago. I went to a British university and had an American supervisor. He forbade me from using any papers from researchers at any Asian universities. He was a cool guy.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 17 Jul 2019 17:03:11 No.10814785 Report

Quoted By:

>>10814777
god asian papers are so garbage, once in awhile I'll find something interesting from Japan but 99% of the papers are poorly written and very bad at presenting their actual results - to the point where I doubt they really had any meaningful results

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 17 Jul 2019 17:20:45 No.10814819 Report

Quoted By: >>10815280

>>10814694
>>10814710
You didn't even finish high school. Stop larping, /pol/fags.
>>10814704
The quality of US-American products proves that European degrees in engineering are objectively superior.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 17 Jul 2019 20:33:04 No.10815280 Report

Quoted By:

>>10814819
Over engineering is by definition not good engineering you idiot.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 18 Jul 2019 05:48:24 No.10816316 Report

Quoted By: >>10816436

>>10814704
Why is flooding the world with papers a proof of anything?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 18 Jul 2019 06:02:34 No.10816334 Report

Quoted By:

They don't want you competing with their work in the process, that will make it look like multiple bankers sharing their info, that is illegal mostly and then the governments non-wigs will move in and attempt to steal it all using the poor bunch of losers that thiink anyone in gorvernment makes a lot of money that isn't just someone from a company being asked to help.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 18 Jul 2019 07:12:57 No.10816436 Report

Quoted By:

>>10816316
What do you mean? Are you critiquing the Bolonga process itself or my rant about cheating through proceedings instead of journal papers?

In general I would say it's a very flawed system. Even in the US, but especially the EU. Just to give you an example of a better one I had to review a thesis recently (in the name of my Professor, but I was paid what they paid him for it so meh) out of fucking South Africa of all places. It turns out that at this particular university they had the following system for PhDs:
>You have to publish 3-5 journal papers in international journals (local ones only count if it has an impact factor higher than 5 or it is listed as a reputable international journal on official indexes)
>You have to pass your thesis through 3 external examiners, 2 of these have to be professors from other countries who are experts in the field
>The professors judge not only the correctness of the thesis, but also if it is actually a unique contribution to the field worthy of a PhD
>If just one says no it's not important enough the candidate fails

For their Masters degree it's one paper, one external (no course work based Masters allowed, but the paper doesn't have to be important).

Now, my university also has a system for externals, but they can be domestic, i.e. it's usually your PI's friend. And the thing is if you're collaborating closely then any improvement seems significant to them. In the EU you don't even need externals at all in some places. This snobbish attitude is in my opinion what lead to their inbreeding where people get a PhD with fucking conference talks and a half assed thesis.

I would propose the following system:
>Minimum 3 journal papers in international journals
>Either 2 additinal conference paper or one additional journal paper
>Two external experts in your field
>One external expert outside your field, but inside your discipline

The last one will do much to keep research fields healthy and productive.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 18 Jul 2019 15:24:12 No.10816999 Report

Quoted By: >>10817012

This thread implies that people able to judge papers are scrolling 4chan ?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 18 Jul 2019 15:43:36 No.10817012 Report

Quoted By:

>>10816999
I've been invited to review manuscripts submitted to journals for publication multiple times.

So yes.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 18 Jul 2019 17:21:54 No.10817191 Report

Quoted By:

At the risk of pointing out the blatantly obvious—maybe they just have bad English skills

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