/sci/ - Science & Math » Thread #12343227

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Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 04:23:09 2020 No.12343227 View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>12343252 >>12343295 >>12343319 >>12343336 >>12343517 >>12343522 >>12343561 >>12343588 >>12343892 >>12343894 >>12344359 >>12344484 >>12345876 >>12345890 >>12345973 >>12346810

>pi is irrational
>there are no repetitions in the digit sequence of pi
>you can find an sequence representing the works of shakespeare inside pi
>you can find any other work represented inside pi

Does pi contain pi?
If it did, we could see a repetition, leading to a contradiction. Then Pi does not contain pi.
Therefore pi does not contain everything.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 04:27:01 No.12343240 Report

Quoted By: >>12343244

you can't use logic on it, it's irrational

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 04:27:59 No.12343244 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343240
it's not a woman

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 04:29:58 No.12343252 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343227
Pi is the universe itself, reality when expressed as a number would be 3.14159265359...

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 04:49:19 No.12343295 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343227
>Does pi contain pi?
If you start from the first digit then obviously it contains itself, but that doesn't contradict anything.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 04:53:05 No.12343304 Report

Quoted By:

it does contain pi.
it does repeat.
you just have to find the end of pi to see it repeat.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 04:59:43 No.12343319 Report

Quoted By: >>12343370

>>12343227
You can't have pi inside pi because then pi wouldn't be irrational. Let's say pi = x + pi*10^n, where n is some negative integer and x represents the digits of pi before we reach the sequence of pi in it. Since x cannot be unlimited (eventually, we must see pi in it) x must be rational. Now, pi(1-10^n) = x, so pi = x/(1-10^n) which is a rational number. Thus, it cannot be true.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 05:08:35 No.12343336 Report

Quoted By: >>12343488 >>12343521

>>12343227
>>pi is irrational
Yes
>>there are no repetitions in the digit sequence of pi
Yes
>>you can find an sequence representing the works of shakespeare inside pi
Probably not
>>you can find any other work represented inside pi
Probably not
>Does pi contain pi?
No

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 05:23:25 No.12343370 Report

Quoted By: >>12343550 >>12346737

>>12343319
surely the sequece 31 is in pi (as a strict subset)?
yes
and 314?
yes
and 31415?
why not more digits

faggot

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 06:19:24 No.12343488 Report

Quoted By: >>12343550 >>12344325

>>12343336
>Probably not
>what is the infinite monkey theorem

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 06:22:07 No.12343503 Report

Quoted By: >>12343507

If the digits of pi are randomly distributed you would eventually find anything in its digits. But it couldn't contain a strict subset of pi itself since pi is infinite.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 06:25:14 No.12343507 Report

Quoted By: >>12343550

>>12343503
Pi contains literally all possiblestrings of numbers, including exactly 1 pi

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 06:28:50 No.12343517 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343227
these are all properties of irrational numbers, nothing specific to pi.

>does an irrational contain itself

no

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 06:30:40 No.12343521 Report

Quoted By: >>12343550

>>12343336
>>you can find an sequence representing the works of shakespeare inside pi
Probably not

false

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 06:30:53 No.12343522 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343227
>>pi is irrational
Really?
$\pi = \frac \pi 1$
I thought irrationals couldn't be expressed as ratios?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 06:47:30 No.12343550 Report

Quoted By: >>12343554

>>12343488
>>12343521
>>12343370
>>12343507
Having infinite digits in it doesn't mean you can find everything in it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 06:49:02 No.12343554 Report

Quoted By: >>12343557

>>12343550
Yes, but they're infinite randomly distributed digits, so you actually can.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 06:51:28 No.12343557 Report

Quoted By: >>12343569 >>12343656

>>12343554
>they're infinite randomly distributed digits
Doubt.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 06:53:41 No.12343561 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343227
Pi is essentially the number that quantifies how the universe works, it's like a magic number. It probably contains every non-infinite number possible.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 06:57:52 No.12343569 Report

Quoted By: >>12343620

>>12343557
https://blogs.sas.com/content/iml/2015/03/12/digits-of-pi.html

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 07:01:40 No.12343572 Report

Quoted By: >>12343652

It depend on whether or not pi is a normal number. I think it is suspected to be but this isn’t proven afaik

Anonymous

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Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 07:07:22 No.12343588 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343227
So many retards in this thread, pi cant expressed as a faction of two integers, and any number that repeats its decimal places can. So no, pi isn't in pi in some kind of endless nested loop, because if it was then it wouldn't be irrational.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Repeating_decimal

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 07:15:22 No.12343595 Report

Quoted By: >>12343599

you're being semantic. It means it contains every integer sequence, not real sequence. So it contains every sequence which can be generated finitely. Maybe even with cardinality omega, but that seems improbable. I'm pretty sure it means, in those digits, you should be able to find any finite sequence (a1,...,an), which means n is not equal to the cardinality of the natural numbers, and each ai is a natural number.

Ask me more questions if confused.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 07:17:45 No.12343599 Report

Quoted By: >>12343600 >>12343652

>>12343595
We don't know if pi contains every possible sequence of integers

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 07:20:05 No.12343600 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343599
ok then, this whole thread is useless, pi is just an irrational number. Meaning that it isnt contained in the set of Q, and relates somehow to a dedekind cut, and the thing that says irrational numbers contain ever "something", is just a myth, and some pop sci bullcrap.

Case closed. But even if that isn't right, doesn't matter, what does matter is that it is irrational, and how pi is defined by a circle or several other ways. And irrational? Dedekind cuts.

Yes?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 07:35:44 No.12343620 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343569
>no proof

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 07:59:11 No.12343652 Report

Quoted By: >>12344492

>>12343572
>>12343599

we "don't know" in the same sense that we "don't know" that the riemann hypothesis is true. It almost certainly is true it's just really fucking hard to prove but for all practical purposes it's safe to assume it's true (otherwise all banking security algorithms wouldn't rely on RH for however long RSA algorithms were in use)

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 08:00:36 No.12343656 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343557
>doubt

not really

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 10:21:05 No.12343892 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343227
Pi has the recipe for every pie

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 10:23:15 No.12343894 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343227
infinite doesn't imply all-encompassing

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 14:36:59 No.12344322 Report

Quoted By:

The entirety of pi? No

But any finite cut of it does

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 14:37:28 No.12344325 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343488
If you take away the S key before you give them the typewriter they will never even write the cover page.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 14:49:44 No.12344359 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343227
If pi is infinite then it must repeat infinitely

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 15:36:23 No.12344484 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343227
If you wanted to find where in a specific series of numbers occurs in pi it would usually take more numbers just describing WHERE that section occurs. For example if you wanted to find where 8888888888888 occurs (thirteen 8s in a row) it would likely take more than 13 symbols just to explain where that was located in the pi decimals. And if you wanted to find where the entire works of Shakespeare was located it would likely take more numbers than all the work of Shakespeare just to explain the location of this occurrence. Not nearly as intriguing if you look at it this way.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 15:37:38 No.12344492 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343652
We didn't reply on RSA because we think RH is true. It's just that factoring large integer is hard and can't be practical to do so yet.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 21:21:29 No.12345861 Report

Quoted By:

I was high when I made this thread, but I'm not surprised it got so many replies. /sci/ is not a place for smart people

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 21:24:14 No.12345876 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343227
If pi contains everything then it would also contain every repetition

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 21:27:20 No.12345890 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343227
quite interesting.

still there are a billion consecutive 9s somewhere in pi.
and my birthday date.
even the girth of your mom fits in it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 21:39:34 No.12345973 Report

Quoted By: >>12346925

>>12343227
if you unironically want an answer pi contains every FINITE sequence of numbers, not literally everything

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 22:54:01 No.12346386 Report

Quoted By: >>12349238

I FUCKING LOVE MATH!

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 23:41:57 No.12346737 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343370
>Gets simple and succinct explanation for why he's wrong
>Doesn't understand at all
Retard

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 15 Nov 2020 23:51:06 No.12346810 Report

Quoted By:

>>12343227
it is meant to contain every finite sequence.
just like euler's number.
but no infinite sequences. so it would fail at something as basic as 1/3.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 16 Nov 2020 00:05:34 No.12346925 Report

Quoted By:

>>12345973
>pi contains every FINITE sequence of numbers
Wrong, pi does not contain the sequence
8767168716546541657657777765456541374687643413767656324244468787641113347678974213

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 16 Nov 2020 08:12:33 No.12349238 Report

Quoted By:

>>12346386
>I FUCKING LOVE MATH!

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