/sci/ - Science & Math » Thread #12227184

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Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 18:10:15 2020 No.12227184 View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>12227224 >>12227229 >>12227260 >>12227385 >>12227589 >>12227625 >>12227787 >>12227955 >>12227977 >>12227978 >>12228242 >>12228511 >>12228669 >>12228753 >>12228826 >>12228967 >>12229391 >>12232721

>Go for CS minor
>first class
>spend 3 hous teaching you how to do a for loop.
>3 hours teaching you what an array is.
>every excercise is so easy, i could've pulled it off in middle school.

Is CS for literal retards?

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 18:19:09 No.12227224 Report

Quoted By: >>12227240

>>12227184

The real retard is you for taking an intro CS class when you already know the material instead of actually taking advantage of the school you're presumably paying for by pushing yourself to learn something new.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 18:21:01 No.12227229 Report

Quoted By: >>12227955 >>12228673

>>12227184
CS
>"okay guys today's lecture is going to be all about the integer data type. We should get through it all but if not we can just pick it up next week. Your homework is to draw a fun picture of your favorite integer :D"

Math/Physics/Engineering
>"I recommend everyone purchase some knee pads for the semester because all of your time is either gonna be spent getting facefucked or praying to God."

Anonymous

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Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 18:24:00 No.12227240 Report

Quoted By: >>12227294

>>12227224
>You already know the material

No, but you need to be a literal retard not to be able to shit like, "Loop through the array, find all clinets whose are such and such and print out theie names" .

Anonymous

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Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 18:28:11 No.12227260 Report

Quoted By: >>12227475 >>12227975

>>12227184
>Never go for CS
>Teach self to program in MS batch
>End up inventing most of the concepts used in C and other languages (thread pools, scope, calling convention, string manipulation functions, floating point math, proper array addressing).
>Start learning C
>Skip to C++ instead
>Start looking at and extending existing projects using cppreference and Bjarne's book as a reference
>Basically know C++ now, though only at a hobbiest level of actual development efficiency

I know CS is far broader than just programming and goe sinto the underlying theory of information manipulation and algorithms, but this is really all it takes. You just need to start trying to learn and I think most people, at least on /sci/, could do it.

Also suggesting stuff like python for learning is net harmful imo, at least for minds which are more control oriented and need to know what's actually happening. I've found a lot of python to be way too spaghetti.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 18:39:30 No.12227294 Report

Quoted By: >>12227311 >>12228391

>>12227240

CS 101 is one of the most popular classes for most colleges. It has been watered down to the braindead degree you are experiencing because everyone from business majors to math majors to science majors are put in there.

Theoretical computer science is much less obvious. CS theory is not just memorizing algorithms by the way, finite state machines, regular languages, context free grammars, and decidability are all much more esoteric subjects covered in a basic theory of computation class. Even practical programming gets much more complicated when you strip away the conveniences of high level programming languages like python.

Complaining CS 101 is too easy is like signing up for college algebra then saying a math major is just too easy for you. It's so uninformed you don't even know how stupid you are.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 18:42:51 No.12227311 Report

Quoted By: >>12227330 >>12228822

>>12227294
Well the next class (i'm in 4ight now) is not much better either, it's an introduction to OOP stuff like construcotrs, clsses, interfaces and other shit. The upcoming class is Data Structures whuch includes Graph Theory, hopefully that'll be npre fun.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 18:49:14 No.12227330 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227311

Sounds like your school has set up a super slow burn intro to computer science. Literally all of those subjects were covered between CS 101 and CS 102 at my school. Granted we didn't discuss data structures with mathematical rigor until 3rd year classes because students need to work their way through the mathematical background first (full calc sequence, discrete math, linear algebra, and probability).

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 19:10:32 No.12227385 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227184
if you want to go fast, go alone. if you want to go far, go with others.

this doesn't exactly fit your situation, but it's not completely off the mark.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 19:33:15 No.12227475 Report

Quoted By: >>12227505

>>12227260
>>Start learning C
>>Skip to C++ instead

Ask me how I know you’re retarded

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 19:38:20 No.12227505 Report

Quoted By: >>12228233

>>12227475
How do you know I'm retarded?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 19:40:58 No.12227517 Report

Quoted By: >>12227536 >>12227608 >>12227955 >>12228753

You think CS is retard mode, try being an Information Systems major.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 19:44:34 No.12227536 Report

Quoted By: >>12227551 >>12227566 >>12227608

>>12227517
Hey, at least you will get a job once you graduate.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 19:47:30 No.12227551 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227536
There's a definitely a certain level of calmness I've gotten from knowing I can skate through classes for the rest of college and still come out with a well paying job that isn't taxing. Sometimes I wish I'd gone down a more academically stimulating path, but lately I've been learning that taking college classes doesn't motivate me to give a better effort to things, so I need to want to pursue my passions on my own time.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 19:50:26 No.12227566 Report

Quoted By: >>12227572 >>12232694

>>12227536
>graduated with bachelor's in aerospace engineering degree and comp sci minor in school where both are top 25 programs with over 3.0 GPA
>multiple leadership roles on successful design team projects
>one of which was leading 10+ engineering students over a year
>internship
6 months later
>no job

so this is the power of STEM...

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 19:52:01 No.12227572 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227566
>aerospace
there's your problem.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 19:54:56 No.12227589 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227184
It takes time to teach it because CS niggers are too fucking retarded to come up with their own nomenclature instead of stealing words used in other areas for their technical bullshit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 19:58:47 No.12227608 Report

Quoted By: >>12227914

>>12227517
>>12227536
Why would anyone hire an IS retard? Isn't it literally CS with a tenth as much depth?

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 20:02:29 No.12227618 Report

Quoted By:

The one thing I can say about college is you're either feeling numbbrained because it's going too fast or it's slow as piss but when it's slow as piss it makes you want to learn more

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 20:04:33 No.12227625 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227184
should've done computer engineering, idiot

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 21:00:42 No.12227787 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227184
>take introductory class
>they introduce me to the material
wtf?

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 21:30:02 No.12227914 Report

Quoted By: >>12227955 >>12228009

>>12227608

Looking at a few different school's curriculum around this major, it's because businesses need middle-men between the CS autists and MBA suits to explain things to each other. However other than middlemen there are a lot of roles in tech that require zero mathematical, theoretical, or even very little programming knowledge. Shit like helpdesk or system administration. CS majors hate those roles because they would find them to be too dull but businesses need warm bodies to fill those roles so that's another place where IS comes in.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 21:40:32 No.12227955 Report

Quoted By: >>12228009 >>12228057 >>12228059

>>12227184
Where I went you could test out of all the “intro” classes like that and go straight into data structures/algorithms.
>>12227229
Math classes are *not* that bad.
>>12227517
Lol
>>12227914
These roles definitely do get filled by CS majors. Some places have hiring requirements for them that disqualify everyone else (god knows why.)

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 21:44:58 No.12227975 Report

Quoted By: >>12228375

>>12227260
Python is just Legos for programming. I tell everyone to learn Python because even if they don't end up pursuing it as a hobby, they're guaranteed to learn something about programming as a basic level. I would never recommend anyone learn C++ like I did when I was 12.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 21:45:15 No.12227977 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227184
>lainfag is dunning kruger
every time

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 21:45:46 No.12227978 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227184
Yes.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 21:49:46 No.12227999 Report

Quoted By: >>12228002

I'm doing a dual CS/Math major. My school's CS minor is 6 courses, 2 of which I've taken so far.

The first course in my path was supposed to be an Intro to Programming course where you learn the fundamentals of programming as if you are an 18 year old student who has never programmed before. It's not supposed to filter people out yet.

I was able to skip it by special exception, showing the department chair my own projects, and completing the final in a weekend.

The other course was just learning how to use Java, object oriented programming, etc. It was a bit harder but not difficult at all.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 21:51:03 No.12228002 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227999
The only other required course is Calculus (or Applied Calculus). For 24 credits, it doesn't seem like too hard of a minor.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 21:52:04 No.12228009 Report

Quoted By: >>12228057

>>12227955
>>12227914
It's stupid to fill those roles with CS majors when things like CompTIA's A+ exists and those people are probably less salary demanding

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 22:04:08 No.12228057 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227955
>These roles definitely do get filled by CS majors.

Which roles? Middle management or administrators?

In theory it certainly is possible for CS people to fulfill both roles, although it is definitely overkill for administrators. CS grads in middle management are more rare though. I have seen CS grads there but typically only if they are good leaders and social.

>Some places have hiring requirements for them that disqualify everyone else (god knows why.)

Typically because the HR department is too incompetent to know what they actually need. However, most of the listings I've seen ask for a "bachelors in computer science or related field" as a soft requirement. Many even add on the stipulation that real world experience can supplant that requirement.

>>12228009
this.

A lot of businesses are waking up to the fact that they can find incredibly cheap labor in people with spurious qualifications like the CompTIA certs or an IS degree.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 22:04:22 No.12228059 Report

Quoted By: >>12228076

>>12227955
Math classes can go from moderately easy to dummyham hard largely depending on the professor and content. Calc 1-3, DiffEq, LinAlgebra, Discrete Math, and Abstract Algebra are mostly self taught subjects where how good you do is really on you. Things like number theory, stats, game theory, and topology are legitimately challenging subjects where the right professor can make you and the wrong professor can break you.

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 22:09:38 No.12228076 Report

Quoted By: >>12228093 >>12228587

>>12228059
A math minor at my uni requires
>Calc 1
>Calc 2
>Calc 3
>Linear Algebra
>Diff Eq
>A 4XX course
>20-21 credits
So 1 less class than the CS minor

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 22:14:53 No.12228093 Report

Quoted By: >>12228677

>>12228076

Are you saying that a cs minor is more difficult than a math minor? Not trying to be a dick I legit have no clue what you mean

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 22:58:58 No.12228233 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227505
because you voluntarily chose to learn sepples

Anonymous

Anonymous Tue 13 Oct 2020 23:01:35 No.12228242 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227184
It’s an intro course for a subject many don’t touch until college. CS has its problems but just take the freebie semester

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 00:01:02 No.12228375 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227975
had to get the brag in there

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 00:06:27 No.12228391 Report

Quoted By: >>12228404

>>12227294
This but unironically, I've always been lightyears ahead in my undergrad honors CS classes but even I'm having trouble fourth year Operating Systems shit where they make us work with Linux Kernels and shit. Comparatively I did 30 minutes of work a month in my first year CS classes, and I'm not even exaggerating.
Yeah I'm humblebragging idgaf nigger

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 00:13:20 No.12228404 Report

Quoted By: >>12228417 >>12228433

>>12228391
>they make us work with Linux Kernels and shit
Lol any moron from /g/ can do this.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 00:19:26 No.12228417 Report

Quoted By: >>12228426

>>12228404
Apart from the fact that 95% of /g/ are webdev javascripters and retard private tracker/pc component/linux circlejerkers, it's pretty complicated stuff.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 00:21:25 No.12228426 Report

Quoted By: >>12228438

>>12228417
>Hurder mutex locks and linked lists in C are rocket science.

There’s a lot of code, and being on the other side of all the syscalls is confusing. There’s nothing difficult about it though.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 00:22:45 No.12228433 Report

Quoted By: >>12228454 >>12228470

>>12228404
I'm pretty sure he means that they're having the students make POSIX compliant kernels, schedulers, and memory models. OS is known to be a tough class to grok, and it's definitely a workhorse class. The theory is pretty easy but realizing it is hard.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 00:24:33 No.12228438 Report

Quoted By: >>12228454

>>12228426
>nothing about it is difficult
When you're implementing asychronity on your own memory model it's actually pretty difficult. Even making it complaint with the canonical bit masking, even using the system functions to long jump rather than store the address yourself, it's actually pretty difficult to realize.
I know because I spent a month debugging mutual exclusion on protected memory I carved and buffered myself.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 00:27:35 No.12228454 Report

Quoted By: >>12228470 >>12228539 >>12228541

>>12228433
That’s certainly more interesting and absolutely not what he said.
>>12228438
No. This is trivially easy to do from scratch in decent language with continuations. Even in C it’s not so bad but you have to make some assumptions.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 00:31:05 No.12228470 Report

Quoted By:

>>12228454
>>12228433
Sorry, I meant to say kernel modules, i.e. the project I'm working on right now is an extension of the ntfs filesystem reader (as a kernel module). The class covers a wide variety of stuff, i.e. last project was just TCP sockets for a 4-way communication client, which was simple but tedius since I had to do it in C, and pthreads are annoying to use.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 00:39:40 No.12228511 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227184
I agree it's pretty easy.
but for my class the entire grade is based on a few assignments so if you fuck up some style errors but still have external correctness your grade will still be fucked slightly.
also I was pissed once when I wrote beautiful code but I read one paragraph down and it said I couldn't use if statements for that assignment.
then I cried.
CS sucks because it's monotonous about retarded shit, not because it's hard.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 00:46:30 No.12228539 Report

Quoted By: >>12228541

>>12228454
>No. This is trivially easy to do from scratch in decent language with continuations. Even in C it’s not so bad but you have to make some assumptions.
...no, it isn't. Making sure all asynchronous structures (mutual exclusion, semaphores, scheduling policy, context switching, etc.) worked well with m-protect and could talk to the disk properly was a bitch.
I'd like to say it's trivial, but no, it took a lot more effort than anyone likes to admit.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 00:47:47 No.12228541 Report

Quoted By: >>12228549

>>12228454
>>12228539
I should mention that by "talking to disk" I mean that we wrote disk policy and did tray spins from scratch. The whole semester was devoted to writing OS components in user space, and then tying it together with a kernel and doing it for real. It's well known material but not trivial.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 00:50:13 No.12228549 Report

Quoted By:

>>12228541
Alright that does sound pretty intense.
It’s definitely not what the other guy was doing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 01:02:39 No.12228587 Report

Quoted By: >>12228677

>>12228076
>minor
>20-21 credits
Huh? A minor at my school was like 15 credits. Electrical Engineering majors where like a course away from a Physics or Math minor, Physics majors where a course away from a Math minor, and Math majors where a course away from a Physics minor.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 01:29:36 No.12228669 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227184
read the art of computer programming by donald knuth, its a good read

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 01:30:42 No.12228673 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227229
mathematics is the easiet subject to learn, its just not the easiest to understand

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 01:32:11 No.12228677 Report

Quoted By:

>>12228093
1 more course of work, degree of difficulty comes down to how well you can think logically like a computer/mathematically
>>12228587
The 20-21 credits is if you took zero math at all (like with a liberal arts degree or something, I'm assuming).

Adding a math minor to a Physics BSc = 3 credits or 0 credits (depending on which track)
Adding a math minor to a CS BSc = 12 credits

A bunch of the CS-related minors are also 12 credits, since they're more specialized (data science, programming, etc)

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 01:45:24 No.12228719 Report

Quoted By:

breh the compsci hate on this board is so sperg. i have a math degree and a compsci degree and they were equally difficult in different ways.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 01:58:15 No.12228753 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227184
>first class is retarded
what do you expect? trying to prove P=NP?
>>12227517
>BBA
no thanks

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 02:27:08 No.12228822 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227311
Data Structures should be challenging, depending on whether or not you have to do things like analyze the algorithms for each method of each structure for time complexity and have to program your own searching algorithms.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 02:28:01 No.12228826 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227184
>Is CS for literal retards?
no, your school is

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 03:23:54 No.12228967 Report

Quoted By: >>12228990

>>12227184
In engineering at least, they do this (same level of challenge) for 4 years and then you get dumped into a job field where people are working with tech you've never even heard of. School is way too basic these days.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 03:29:38 No.12228990 Report

Quoted By:

>>12228967
>t.went to a shit engineering school
Electrical Engineers at my school had to take the quantum physics 1 and 2 sequence that physic majors took if they wanted to specialize in semiconductor physics.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 05:44:31 No.12229391 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227184
These are the beginner classes where they teach you basic shit about programming. It's like complaining that the first class for a math major is calc. Wait until you take a class on formal languages or algorithms.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 06:36:05 No.12229546 Report

Quoted By: >>12230692

>this is too easy reeeeeee!
do you think ed witten thought that during undergrad? or maybe he just applied himself beyond the content presented. but no, midwits like you have to complain that the bar is so low. be thankful

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 14:35:43 No.12230692 Report

Quoted By: >>12232663

>>12229546
>ed witten
who?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 23:46:14 No.12232663 Report

Quoted By:

>>12230692
wittgenstein you fucking pseud

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 14 Oct 2020 23:53:56 No.12232694 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227566
>aerospace

You picked a major that’s taken up by supreme autists who are willing to work for pennies just to put their hands on the tech and have been doing this shit since they were 10. You fucked yourself.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Thu 15 Oct 2020 00:01:43 No.12232721 Report

Quoted By:

>>12227184
There are many schools around the world teaching REAL computer science. Neat stuff like computational theory, advanced stats, advanced algorithms, lambda calculus, real time systems, advanced image processing, language theory...
It's sad, but you appear to have landed in a code monkey kindergarten.

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