/sci/ - Science & Math » Thread #12180053

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ATTENTION BIO CHEMISTS

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 01:14:07 2020 No.12180053 View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>12180130 >>12180132 >>12180196 >>12180239 >>12180245 >>12180258

hello /sci/

disclaimer, i'm not a scientist of any kind. i'm an artist writing a story for a personal project.

i'm trying to create a believable fictional drug based off of 5-MeO-DMT, which i've read is 4~5 times more potent as a hallucinogen than DMT. but i wanted something more stronger/lethal than that for the extra edge and to give me a little more flexibility for story/visuals reason.

does pic related make much sense? my buddy who is a researcher in genetics helped me try to figure this out but he's not entirely sure if it looks/sounds right either.

he wrote the blurb in the pic based off a paper we read, and drew the scribbled figures in a way to try to explain this theoretical drug.

Anonymous

View Same Google iqdb SauceNAO example.png, 129KiB, 549x837

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 01:31:08 No.12180101 Report

Quoted By: >>12180132

bump, i'm willing to draw for someone who can help me figure this out in a believable way.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 01:38:36 No.12180130 Report

Quoted By: >>12180158 >>12180266

>>12180053
generally the metilated drugs are more potent becasue they go more to the brain because its fatty and nonpolar, at least in heroin. However it could also change the drug in other ways or be inestable
not a chemist either but used to be quite into it 3 years ago

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 01:39:28 No.12180132 Report

Quoted By: >>12180140 >>12180158

>>12180053
>>12180101
So I've published a few fiction stories (I write mostly horror, so take that as you will) and I'm a PhD.
Not a single reader in all of the world will EVER want you to explain the fucking chemical reaction in a damn book.
I do a lot of genetics shit/cell biology shit for a living, and I would immediately throw a book in the trash if it starts explaining cell biology 101 or beyond.
There is nothing exciting to a reader about explaining a chemical reaction to this detail.
You can use this as a vague premise and just suggest its possible with some buzzword chem terms thrown in and that would be almost too much for the average reader.
You can make it sound vaguely right (we know that DMT is crazy as fuck and you see the machine elves for 5 minutes, we've been able to make a potent analog that's 5x stronger with 5-MeO-DMT; we've recent figures out a way to enhance the binding to seratonin receptors almost permanently or w/e and estimate it's 500x stronger. The effects were something we never could have dreamed of. The machine elves? They're real. But they aren't as we thought they were in our meek, 5 minute sessions. The truth is, we weren't ready for an extended interaction with the beings..."
whatever you get the drill.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 01:41:49 No.12180140 Report

Quoted By: >>12180158

>>12180132
yeah he obviously is a wannabe drug cooker and make his own product getho way, or he is just completely autistic

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 01:48:22 No.12180158 Report

Quoted By: >>12180172 >>12180266

>>12180130
>metilated drugs
what do you mean by this term? both my buddy and i aren't sure what it means, but it sounds interesting.

>>12180132
yeah i understand your point, it was supposed to be for background visuals and a short premise to sound/look believable. (gonna be drawing a lot of computer screens and stuff)

but i guess most importantly is the name; i remember when bob lazar claimed element 115 was something out of this world but it turned out moscovium was real and the elements number is based off the weight and nothing like what bob described and his whole story fell apart after actual scientists/engineers figured that out.

i just don't wanna run into the same "trap". if naming is more trouble than it's worth, i will likely use the route you've mentioned but even that requires a bit of research i think.

>>12180140
kek i haven't even touched anything beyond weed before. i'm an autistic artist though, you got that part right.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 01:53:18 No.12180172 Report

Quoted By: >>12180180 >>12180285

>>12180158
I think that's the + of being "vague enough"
If you're too specific (this is isotope 115 and literally nothing else), if the "real world" produces it, it makes your shit super fake
but if you make it vague (some synthetic substitutions of this, that, the other, and a few clever bond tricks, but the formula is hidden), then no matter what, your shit is always "possible"
Vague helps in this scenario. You can learn the right terms and just use them to justify a vague/proprietary compound and leave it at that.
It's like revealing the monster. All good horror stories barely describe the monster, because our imagination is WAY more effective at filling in the gaps than the english language. Describing the monster in detail is some boring, mundane shit. Let the reader fill in the vague forbidden, tricky chemistry (alchemic?) knowledge. They'll love it.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 01:55:17 No.12180180 Report

Quoted By:

>>12180172
alright, good points. i'm not a chemist and neither is my buddy but i guess we can riff off some papers online to vaguely describe something instead of making it a realistic name.

i'll draw whatever you want. let me know and i'll deliver within the night.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 02:00:56 No.12180196 Report

Quoted By: >>12180220

>>12180053
analyze the differences in the binding pockets of 5-HT2a vs 5-HT1a, retroactively subsitute functional groups on your drug that spacially and electromagnetically "fits better" in this binding pocket of 5-HT2a and "fits worse" in 5-HT1a. Youll have to get a xray crystallography structure of these receptors to determine those points. one example of changing these functional groups around is the ether on 5MeODMT

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 02:10:06 No.12180220 Report

Quoted By:

>>12180196
so does the adding the additional ether at the 3' carbon count as modifying the functional groups to improve activity? like the example in the pic my buddy drew, it looks about right?

Anonymous

View Same Google iqdb SauceNAO 4,5-MDO-DMT.gif, 778B, 174x148

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 02:19:01 No.12180239 Report

Quoted By: >>12180267

>>12180053
Somewhat relevant:
https://erowid.org/library/books_online/tihkal/tihkal30.shtml
https://www.erowid.org/library/books_online/tihkal/tihkal31.shtml

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 02:20:57 No.12180243 Report

Quoted By: >>12180267

Depending on who makes it, you could play around with the fact that its name and description are wildly inaccurate. If this is some methlab turned psychedelics factory, maybe the guy who made it legitimately has no idea what it is, and he himself made up gibberish to explain it?

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 02:21:11 No.12180245 Report

Quoted By: >>12180267

>>12180053
Your numbering is wrong. 4 and 6 should be flipped. The molecule in your pic should be called 5,7-MeO-DMT.

Anonymous

View Same Google iqdb SauceNAO 5-MeO-7-TMT.png, 8KiB, 799x726

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 02:24:42 No.12180258 Report

Quoted By: >>12180285

>>12180053
Your molecule probably wouldn't be psychedelic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5-Methoxy-7%2CN%2CN-trimethyltryptamine

>5-Methoxy-7,N,N-trimethyltryptamine (5-MeO-7,N,N-TMT, 5-MeO-7-TMT), is a tryptamine derivative which acts as an agonist at the 5-HT2 serotonin receptors.[1][2] In animal tests, both 7,N,N-TMT and 5-MeO-7,N,N-TMT produced behavioural responses similar to those of psychedelic drugs such as DMT and 5-MeO-DMT, but compounds with larger 7-position substituents such as 7-ethyl-DMT and 7-bromo-DMT did not produce psychedelic-appropriate responding despite high 5-HT2 receptor binding affinity, suggesting these may be antagonists or weak partial agonists for the 5-HT2 receptors.[3] The related compound 7-MeO-MiPT (cf. 5-MeO-MiPT) was also found to be inactive, suggesting that the 7-position has poor tolerance for bulky groups at this position, at least if agonist activity is desired.[4]

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 02:29:32 No.12180266 Report

Quoted By: >>12180285

>>12180130
>>12180158
I think he meant "methylated," but could be wrong.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methylation

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 02:29:33 No.12180267 Report

Quoted By:

>>12180239
amazing, thank you. i'll look into this. i've never heard of these before.

>>12180243
>gibberish
haha except i suck at science gibberish and it will literally sound retarded. it's kind of why i'm turning to my buddy and you guys. already learned some chem thanks to you all.

>>12180245
hey, good catch; can you explain how you counted the carbons? when my buddy was making this drawing, he didn't understand where the 5 came from in the first place and just sort of guessed the rest.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 01 Oct 2020 02:36:07 No.12180285 Report

Quoted By:

>>12180258
thank you, it's good to know for the story/lore as well.

>>12180266
oh kek. thanks for clearing that up.

if >>12180172 doesn't say anything i'll just draw quick sketches for anyone interested itt, you guys were all great. i'm gonna be reviewing my script and storyboards in the meanwhile and will probably be off for the night.

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