/sci/ - Science & Math » Thread #11666267

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Inertial Mass Reduction

Anonymous Wed 13 May 04:29:03 2020 No.11666267 View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>11667847 >>11668518 >>11668535 >>11668638 >>11668700 >>11671282

https://patents.google.com/patent/US20170313446A1/en?inventor=Salvatore+Pais&oq=inventor:(Salvatore+Pais)

>decades of sightings of triangle shaped craft that defies gravity linked to US military
>patent for craft and systems that look exactly like anti gravity ship and alleges to produce anti gravity patented by US Navy
>durr its just a coincidence
https://www.military.com/video/aircraft/military-aircraft/tr-3b-aurora-anti-gravity-spacecrafts/2860314511001

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 07:13:05 No.11666666 Report

Quoted By:

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 15:54:40 No.11667603 Report

Quoted By: >>11667770

laughing at schizos rn

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 16:29:24 No.11667727 Report

Quoted By: >>11667734

bump

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 16:31:33 No.11667734 Report

Quoted By: >>11667770

>>11667727
Take the hint: nobody liked your thread.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 16:41:20 No.11667760 Report

Quoted By:

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 16:44:49 No.11667770 Report

Quoted By: >>11667836 >>11668615

>>11667603
>>11667734
This concept has already been substantiated by respected physicists. But the power necessary to make this work is literally impossible to produce by the means we have available for us.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 17:08:24 No.11667836 Report

Quoted By:

>>11667770
> We just need a less-than-frictionless bearing or symmetry-breaking spondilucks device.
The RF cavity resonator ordeal was a souring detractor for me.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 17:11:48 No.11667847 Report

Quoted By: >>11667897

>>11666267
what level of physics do i need to understand his arguments here?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 17:26:45 No.11667897 Report

Quoted By: >>11668643

>>11667847
Any intro to QM and QED.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 20:41:45 No.11668518 Report

Quoted By: >>11668563

>>11666267
What people never touch on about these patents is that the guy who filed them, Dr Pais, has a history of working for the navy developing air warfare equipment. His patents where initially denied by the patent office, but the guy in charged of navy research told the patent office that the room temperature superconductor and the electromagnetic craft patents Pais filed are "operable" and the patents were accepted.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 20:46:25 No.11668535 Report

Quoted By: >>11668563

>>11666267
fun fact: you don't need your technology to be feasible or functional to win a patent. it just has to be novel, non-obvious, and useful.

warpdrives and sci-fi nonsense are often novel non-obvious, and useful, but it doesn't make them possible. all your patent signifies is that you paid ~$20,000 for the 20-year legal right to prevent anyone else from building your warp drive idea, if and ever it became possible to build.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 20:52:51 No.11668563 Report

Quoted By: >>11668567 >>11668578 >>11668585

>>11668535
You're just speculating here with a lack of information. Here
>>11668518
I explained that scenario around the patents, of which there are several, all from Dr Pais. He's not some random guy, he's spent his entire career working on classified projects for the US military. And it's the military that got his patents confirmed. The US parent office first dismissed all his patents as pseudo science, until the navy stepped in and said they were "operable". The war zone did a very long piece in this, they spent ages with foia requests and real journalism hunting down as much information as possible about Pais and his patents. They finally got a story together and talked to Pais, but because he's under numerous NDAs due to high classified work, the pentagon actually reviewed the article and didn't let them publish everything. Now this doesn't mean the patents are realistic, but it raises questions and it's not as simple a scenario as you posted.
Full article
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/31798/the-secretive-inventor-of-the-navys-bizarre-ufo-patents-finally-talks

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 20:54:02 No.11668567 Report

Quoted By:

>>11668563
Ignore the grammatical errors, I'm phone fagging in bed and can't be bithered correcting as it's dark.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 20:58:08 No.11668578 Report

Quoted By: >>11668626 >>11668640 >>11668825

>>11668563
Here's the navy letter that got the patents registered after they were rejected. Raises the question why the navy would 1) get a scientist working for them to register patents on his own name 2) they would go out of their way to tell the patent office to accept them

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:00:17 No.11668585 Report

Quoted By: >>11668591

>>11668563
>You're just speculating here with a lack of information
nothing in that post is a speculation - those are the basic rules of patent law that are taught in every IP class ever. just because you have a link to a patent does not mean the technology described exists in reality

not only that, but only 2% of patents ever make enough money to maintain their protection. expect to see this patent switch to 'Expired - Fee Related' on December 4th, 2021

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:03:08 No.11668591 Report

Quoted By: >>11668624

>>11668585
I just showed you, with evidence, how you're wrong and explained to you how this is not a typical patent case. But yet you drone on like an ass with the same bullshit instead of responding to new information. Yawn. I don't know why I even bother.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:11:30 No.11668615 Report

Quoted By:

>>11667770
>This concept has already been substantiated by respected physicists.
Actually every physicist who has commented on it says it's a bunch of nonsense. Nice try, schizo.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:14:19 No.11668624 Report

Quoted By: >>11668655

>>11668591
Show me the research papers and the prototypes. If there's a patent on this tech, it's already been publicly disclosed and there is zero reason why they would keep the experimental evidence hidden.

Alternatively, it's a trash patent that will expire when the Navy cuts its bullshit-IP budget during the upcoming recession.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:14:49 No.11668626 Report

Quoted By: >>11668655

>>11668578
Whats the point of this post. Who fucking cares what retarded logic the government abides by.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:18:45 No.11668638 Report

Quoted By: >>11668707 >>11668795

>>11666267
Let us count the ways in which this is bullshit:

1. Pais has no education in quantum mechanics

2. These patents are public even though the Navy is the most prolific filer of non-public patents for classified technology (this suggests the Navy wants this to be public in order to confuse rival nations)

3. Every physicist who has commented on it has said it's gibberish

4. "Such high energy EM radiation can locally interact with the Vacuum Energy State (VES) - the VES being the Fifth State of Matter (Fifth Essence - Quintessence), in other words the fundamental structure (foundational framework), from which Everything else (Spacetime included) in our Quantum Reality, emerges."

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:19:46 No.11668640 Report

Quoted By: >>11668664

>>11668578
>1) get a scientist working for them to register patents on his own name
this is typical for lots of government patents. the authors of a patent have no power to exercise the IP - the only important party is the assignee, which is the Navy.

>2) they would go out of their way to tell the patent office to accept them
my guess is that this guy's research group was at risk of getting cut due to no results, and so they reasoned that pushing $20k of grant money to filing some bullshit patents would fluff their progress reports

patents are stupid expensive compared to all other methods of public disclosure, but there's no shortage of idiots willing to chuck a huge pile of cash at the USPTO to gain exclusive rights over technology that nobody would have ever commercialized in 20 years.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:20:03 No.11668643 Report

Quoted By:

>>11667897
>Intro to Schizophrenic Delusions
Fixed.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:22:22 No.11668655 Report

Quoted By: >>11668659 >>11668666 >>11668668

>>11668624
How can I show you classified research papers? Why are you asking stupid questions? The rest of your comment is more speculation. Show me evidence. Show me your research papers ass hole.
>>11668626
Why wouldn't you care? The scientist in charge of directing a Navy research goes out of his way to intercede against the patent office and tells them "the patents are operable". How exactly is that ordinary?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:23:32 No.11668659 Report

Quoted By: >>11668665

>>11668655
>How can I show you classified research papers?
If the research is classified why isn't the patent?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:24:44 No.11668664 Report

Quoted By:

>>11668640
So you're resorting to conspiracy theories as your explanation? Nice. But it doesn't answer any questions.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:26:07 No.11668665 Report

Quoted By: >>11668672

>>11668659
Ask the pentagon. They seem to know much about it, which is why they made the war zone redact information from their conservation with Dr Pais

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:26:32 No.11668666 Report

Quoted By: >>11668702

>>11668655
>How can I show you classified research papers?
if the basis of this technology is hidden in unpublished research papers, then the invention wasn't fully disclosed and the patent is unenforceable. either the authors are idiots, or the claims of this patent are all their group has to show for.

>Show me evidence. Show me your research papers ass hole.
the burden of proof is on the person making scientific claims - that's you. technology is not just 'assumed to work' because there's a patent on it. only idiots have their eyes sparkle just because someone patented something.

https://patents.google.com/patent/US6368227

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:26:52 No.11668668 Report

Quoted By: >>11668721

>>11668655
>The scientist in charge of directing a Navy research goes out of his way to intercede against the patent office and tells them "the patents are operable".
LOL the "scientist" in charge has a PhD in physiological optics. Hardly qualifying him to determine the veracity of quantum woo. Either the Navy is getting scammed or they're trying to get others to waste time on junk science. Pick one.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:28:17 No.11668672 Report

Quoted By: >>11668692

>>11668665
I'm asking you. You have a brain right?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:33:49 No.11668692 Report

Quoted By: >>11668719

>>11668672
How can I tell you know what the pentagon knows? Why are you being obscenely obnoxious and asking stupid questions which you know I can't answer?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:35:21 No.11668700 Report

Quoted By: >>11668739

>>11666267
>>decades of sightings of triangle shaped craft that defies gravity linked to US military
lies
>>patent for craft and systems that look exactly like anti gravity ship and alleges to produce anti gravity patented by US Navy
schizo shit
>>durr its just a coincidence
it is akctually just schizo shit

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:35:34 No.11668702 Report

Quoted By: >>11668711

>>11668666
>the burden of proof is on the person making scientific claims - that's you. technology is not just 'assumed to work' because there's a patent on it. only idiots have their eyes sparkle just because someone patented something.
Tell me where I've argued that they work?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:36:31 No.11668707 Report

Quoted By: >>11668736

>>11668638
>confuse rival nations
does that even work

makes me think that the only one who is confused is the US government

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:37:24 No.11668711 Report

Quoted By: >>11668721

>>11668702
>Tell me where I've argued that they work?
pretty pointless thread if that's not what you're claiming. if this is just a dumb-patents-thread, then I'd be glad to post some of my favorites.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:39:18 No.11668719 Report

Quoted By: >>11668725

>>11668692
>How can I tell you know what the pentagon knows?
The Pentagon is not God, stop avoiding the question.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:39:36 No.11668721 Report

Quoted By: >>11668752 >>11668758 >>11668770

>>11668711
I'm not the op of the thread.
My case in point is that these patents are extremely atypical, and are connected to classified projects. What the rationale is behind it all or whether they work or not, i don't know.
>>11668668
What does the word "operable" mean to you?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:40:43 No.11668725 Report

Quoted By: >>11668756

>>11668719
Your question is retarded and nothing more than some bizzare ego stroke by you to make yourself feel like your position is more "rational".

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:43:28 No.11668736 Report

Quoted By: >>11668747

>>11668707
Well the government claimed the Chinese are already working on this "technology." They're either retarded or purposefully lying.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:44:45 No.11668739 Report

Quoted By: >>11668768

>>11668700
>patent is schizo shit despite link
lo behold, the embodiment of sourceless denyman

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:46:04 No.11668747 Report

Quoted By: >>11668763

>>11668736
Perhaps they know more than you know.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:46:35 No.11668752 Report

Quoted By: >>11668792

>>11668721
>What does the word "operable" mean to you?
it means the person who claimed this technology is "operable" is a fool or a liar. The same fool or liar who claimed that making night vision goggles qualifies him as an expert in quantum physics. Actual experts have all said its a bunch of gibberish. You have nothing to stand on.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:48:15 No.11668756 Report

Quoted By:

>>11668725
Your refusal to face the simple fact that if the government actually cared about this "technology" it would have used a secret patent is telling. They want this to be public. You're in denial.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:48:29 No.11668758 Report

Quoted By:

>>11668721
>My case in point is that these patents are extremely atypical, and are connected to classified projects.
the government doesn't patent their classified projects - why would they ever do that when patents require public disclosure and hostile powers like Iran and North Korea don't give a flying fuck about US patent law?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:49:17 No.11668763 Report

Quoted By:

>>11668747
Then they would keep it a secret. But they explicitly didn't.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:50:19 No.11668768 Report

Quoted By:

>>11668739
>it can't be schizophrenia shit because it has links!
Said the schizo.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:50:25 No.11668770 Report

Quoted By: >>11668799 >>11668812

>>11668721
>What does the word "operable" mean to you?
'operable' is not a criteria for awarding patents. the fact that some guy mentioned that in his letter was not the deciding factor in awarding the patent because the USPTO already doesn't factor in whether the tech is 'operable' when reviewing patent applications. I have a patent and we didn't have to establish whether our invention was operable at any point in the application process.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:57:28 No.11668792 Report

Quoted By: >>11668798 >>11668825

>>11668752
>who claimed that making night vision goggles qualifies him as an expert in quantum physics.
Where does he make that claim? Don't tell me you're making things up, anon...
Given his position as someone who organises research, his job is consulting with actual experts to see if stuff is feasible. He obviously doesn't do research himself. In the letter, he implies it's operable. Meaning the navy has seen it working or has enough reason to believe it works. Peis himself is an aerospace engineer. And what experts are you talking about? You can get 10 experts in a room and they will disagree. Many experts, including Einstein, thought an atom bomb would be too heavy for a aeroplane to drop (as they were making their speculations with a different type of Uranium compared to what was eventually used) and that that they would have to be deployed by a boat.
The US government has a VERY long history of having cutting edge scientists working behind the scenes on black projects. Just because black science man disagrees doesn't mean he knows shit about what DARPA, Navy, Airforce, CIA, and others have.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:58:10 No.11668795 Report

Quoted By:

>>11668638
>"Such high energy EM radiation can locally interact with the Vacuum Energy State (VES) - the VES being the Fifth State of Matter (Fifth Essence - Quintessence), in other words the fundamental structure (foundational framework), from which Everything else (Spacetime included) in our Quantum Reality, emerges."
holy shit this is some Alexis Lemaire thesis type shit

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:58:52 No.11668798 Report

Quoted By: >>11668812

>>11668792
>The US government has a VERY long history of having cutting edge scientists working behind the scenes on black projects
show me the part where they publicly disclosed the recipe for a nuclear bomb in a patent

oh, they didn't? why do you think that is?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 21:58:54 No.11668799 Report

Quoted By:

>>11668770
Clearly the Navy just likes to boast to patent officers about its superior technology. Nothing more can be determined from these inconsistencies. The government is all knowing and mysterious. Praise the government.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 22:03:08 No.11668812 Report

Quoted By: >>11668832 >>11668846

>>11668770
You should read the letter posted above which is specifically addressing the fact the patents were denied because the US patent Office thought they were pseudoscience.
>>11668798
It's entirely plausible that the patents are intentional jibberish to confuse enemies, but that's speculation, and it's entirely possible to speculate various other reasons. My point is that it's very strange.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 22:08:03 No.11668825 Report

Quoted By: >>11668875

>>11668792
>Where does he make that claim?
Right here >>11668578

Actually not only does he claim it, he legally swears to it. Pretty damn funny.

>Meaning the navy has seen it working or has enough reason to believe it works.
Or they were fooled into believing a lie. Or they're lying in order fool others.

>And what experts are you talking about?
The Drive has quoted several throughout their coverage of this canard. They said it has no resemblance to actual quantum physics and is full of gibberish buzzwords.

>You can get 10 experts in a room and they will disagree.
Which means when all of them agree that a non-expert is spouting gibberish about their field, it's probably true.

>The US government has a VERY long history of having cutting edge scientists working behind the scenes on black projects.
And I doubt any of them ever had a public patent. Not to mention that Pais is not a cutting edge scientist in the first place. The men who built the atom bomb were all very accomplished in physics.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 22:10:30 No.11668832 Report

Quoted By: >>11668841

>>11668812
>You should read the letter posted above which is specifically addressing the fact the patents were denied because the US patent Office thought they were pseudoscience.
It doesn't specifically address anything. It falsely claims the author is qualified as an expert in the subject matter of the patent and makes a baseless claim the "technology" is operable. You take the letter at face value while ignoring its content destroys its own credibility.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 22:10:35 No.11668833 Report

Quoted By: >>11668927

Pais defended his design for a compact fusion reactor in the IEEE TPS journal to Tingley stating that the journals acceptance should "...speak volumes as to its importance and credibility - and should eliminate (or at least alleviate) all misconceptions you (or any other person) may have in regard to the veracity (or possibility) of my advanced physics concepts". Pais detailed his discovery of the 'Pais effect' which comprises the "generation of extremely high electromagnetic energy fluxes (and hence high local energy densities) generated by controlled motion of electrically charged matter (from solid to plasma states) subjected to accelerated vibration and/or accelerated spin, via rapid acceleration transients". Pais added that manipulation of the Pais effect can "give rise to the Enablement of Macroscopic Quantum Coherence"

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 22:13:56 No.11668841 Report

Quoted By: >>11669684

>>11668832
No, it states that he is qualified to know because of his position. Which he would be since he approves what is or isn't researched, and presumably eventually tested. But yes, you're right. He could be lying to the patent office on behalf of the Naval Air Systems Command. But for what purpose?

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 22:16:27 No.11668846 Report

Quoted By:

>>11668812
>You should read the letter posted above which is specifically addressing the fact the patents were denied because the US patent Office thought they were pseudoscience.
that's not a reason why patent applications are declined - there are hundreds of patents for alternative medicine woo out there, and the USPTO doesn't care because it's not their job to figure out whether inventions work properly

the US government considers homeopathy a pseudoscience, but you can search the keyword 'homeopathy' among US patents and find 2000+ patents awarded

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 22:25:41 No.11668875 Report

Quoted By:

>>11668825
>The men who built the atom bomb were all very accomplished in physics
Uhh, no. Some were straight out of college. One guy who died after irradiating himself. US government always recruits people straight from college and these people end up working on classified shit all their lives and you never hear about them, unless it becomes declassified.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 22:40:09 No.11668920 Report

Quoted By:

>in another correspondence, Dr. Pais assured The War Zone that “as far as the doubting SMEs [subject matter experts] are concerned, my work shall be proven correct one fine day…”.
God, I hope /sci/ gets BTFO hard one day.

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 22:43:00 No.11668925 Report

Quoted By:

>To help answer those questions, we spoke with Dr. Charles Collett, an assistant professor of Physics at Muhlenberg College who specializes in experimental low-temperature research on the quantum state of molecular magnets. Like most physicists we've spoken to about the Pais patents, Collett remains skeptical.
>While he admits that the theoretical basis for the so-called Pais Effect "is not outlandish, and indeed any charged matter that is undergoing a large amount of acceleration will produce this," Collett notes that there are likely "significant engineering challenges in creating a device" capable of producing such high electromagnetic forces.
/sci/ on suicide watch

Anonymous

Anonymous Wed 13 May 2020 22:43:28 No.11668927 Report

Quoted By:

>>11668833
Literal word salad.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 14 May 2020 03:01:20 No.11669684 Report

Quoted By:

>>11668841
>No, it states that he is qualified to know because of his position.
His position doesn't qualify him to know what he claims to be "well versed" in and a subject matter expert on:
>As a result, I am well versed in the generation of electromagnetic fields, high temperature super conductivity [funny since Pais claims he can do *room temperature* superconductivity, a favorite quack claim], and physics in general (the subject matter of the above application.

Keep grasping at straws.

Anonymous

Anonymous Thu 14 May 2020 14:17:13 No.11671282 Report

Quoted By:

>>11666267
HABEDIN!!!!!

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