/sci/ - Science & Math » Thread #13803800

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Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 16:22:04 2021 No.13803800 View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>13804264 >>13804366 >>13804584 >>13804735 >>13804843 >>13807983 >>13807993 >>13808114 >>13808475 >>13808536 >>13808729

>interviewed with tech company looking to hire physics majors
>"well, with a bachelors, you can become a technician and fix our machines as they break down constantly, or become an engineer and write instructions for fixing machines"
>"what? You wanted to use your degree in any way? Heh, sorry bud, u need a phd assist in any remotely creative pursuit"
>"yeah only being an undergrad trained and researching in several very highly specialized techniques doesnt qualify you to use autocad"

Is it a phd the only way to escape a stanley parable hellscape

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 17:59:49 No.13804104 Report

Quoted By: >>13804111 >>13804268 >>13804330 >>13804572 >>13804901 >>13806506 >>13808656

Most people with degrees are still brainlets. So are most of the people conducting job interviews. The system is fucked up. An IQ test and a written exam would be much better to find the best candidate for a job but unfortunately HR departments are filled with "social science" dimwits who deny the importance of IQ and prefer nepotism over meritocracy.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 18:01:46 No.13804111 Report

Quoted By: >>13804124 >>13810010

>>13804104
Why do you think that college became so common? Once they ditched IQ tests in the 70s, they needed some proxy for IQ so they decided we need to waste 4-10 years of our lives trying to prove what a short test could instead.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 18:07:49 No.13804124 Report

Quoted By:

>>13804111
>Why do you think that college became so common?
Because it's a money making scheme. They invent more and more useless degrees and lower the intellectual requirements every year, so that more retards take on student debt. A 90 IQ Stacy shouldn't go to university. She should work at Walmart or something like that. Now indeed after finishing her degree in postcolonial feminist theory she does work at Walmart, but taking on the student debt was worth it because she can pretend to be an intellectual on Twitter. The whole system relies on such retards.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 18:56:59 No.13804264 Report

Quoted By: >>13804901

>>13803800
>Is it a phd the only way to escape a stanley parable hellscape
Welcome to the modern world of useless credentialism. There isn't an escape easily available.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 19:00:24 No.13804268 Report

Quoted By: >>13808742

>>13804104
>dimwits who deny the importance of IQ
it's literaly illegal to use an IQ test in hiring decisions in the USA. It's retarded but they can't ban proxy iq tests like programming problems.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 19:06:14 No.13804280 Report

Quoted By: >>13808487 >>13808556 >>13808579

Ibm literally uses one of those shape rotation puzzles that you losers love so much for pre-interview screening.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 19:22:28 No.13804330 Report

Quoted By: >>13804342 >>13804555 >>13806247

>>13804104
Look at compsci hiring. People literally grind for hours on practice problems in hopes that their interviewer will give them a problem they've already done. The field is full of idiots now who've literally used rote memorization to solve problems, the exact opposite of what compsci actually needs. The same would be done for any other system that tries to "test" a worker in any way that isn't a "trial working period"

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 19:25:10 No.13804342 Report

Quoted By: >>13810044

>>13804330
And as an addendum, huge companies have shit interviewers who EXPECT you to have these memorized. One time I had a dude loudly sighing and audibly eating his lunch because I was talking through a problem instead of just silently solving it. It's a cycle, the first people who just memorized the answers are now the ones interviewing.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 19:35:41 No.13804366 Report

Quoted By: >>13804476 >>13804869 >>13804901 >>13806484

>>13803800
people with bachelors degrees are literally braindead. bachelors means that you can follow instructions and suck up to your superiors better than a high schooler. if you want to go into more creative research positions, you gotta prove yourself. those positions are risky for the industry and academia to fund, so if you can't prove that you can do research, either independently or at uni in PhD program, then you aren't getting those positions.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 20:09:35 No.13804476 Report

Quoted By:

>>13804366
>prove

You need contacts. That's all.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 20:29:42 No.13804555 Report

Quoted By: >>13804636

>>13804330
isn't this an issue with demand for workers outstripping people suited for the task? I started in compsci, realized I was too stupid to actually intuitively get it, but I got by with rote memorization like you said. I eventually gave up because I realized I'd just be another durgasoft-tier fuckup ruining software if I even got a job. I also feel like all the best programmers are being scooped up by only the biggest and most powerful entities. Whereas in the past high quality programmers were making fucking games.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 20:34:30 No.13804572 Report

Quoted By: >>13806506 >>13808517

>>13804104
>An iq test and a written exam
Lol, you have no idea how the real world functions

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 20:37:06 No.13804584 Report

Quoted By:

>>13803800
Schooling is a trick question. The real point is to make connections and enter job market that way, actually trying to use your degree is industry standard filter, useful only to get compliant people to work for less than they are worth. Basically if your made up story was real you got filtered.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 20:48:52 No.13804636 Report

Quoted By:

>>13804555
I suppose demand could be the cause for the incompetence. More demand=Less standards, but these people still have to get filtered through programming interviews. And due to their nature, it allows people who cram these questions like thoughtless drones to appear to be on the same level of skill or efficiency as people who could intuitively solve these problems... until they actually begin working and you realize they can't even type a complete sentence. If you've ever worked in the field you can pretty clearly identify who's actually thinking and who's just following the motions.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 21:19:22 No.13804735 Report

Quoted By: >>13804805

>>13803800
how is that not a 6x1

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 21:44:10 No.13804805 Report

Quoted By:

>>13804735
>how is that not a 6x1
How is it 6x1? That would measure Area not Volume.
When describing n-dimensional objects we point out every one of it's n measures and we have them multiplied so they give it's n-content. (Here 1-content is Length, 2-content is Area, 3-content is Volume etc.)

If you want to get technical you would say that's a 1x1x1. But since you point out it's a cube it's not necessary to actually point out all 3 dimensions.
In reality you only have to tell one but since it would be weird to say, for example, a 3-cube we agreed to call them 3x3.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 21:54:40 No.13804843 Report

Quoted By:

>>13803800
>Is it a phd the only way to escape a stanley parable hellscape
The >>>/sci/scg FAQ agrees that you need a PhD to get interesting jobs in Physics.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 22:02:20 No.13804869 Report

Quoted By:

>>13804366
all degrees just mean you can follow instruction you retard. the more degrees you have the better a sheep you are.
>here spend 4 years getting this degree
>here spend two more years getting this degree
>here spend two more years getting this degree
>phd now? congratulations, but you are still just a trustworthy monkey and have no prospects outside of private business. you must spend 5-10 more years working towards habilitation/tenure before anyone takes you seriously
Then after all that in the end its more a political popularity contest than anything else.
You're the brain dead one for going along with it and an enemy of humanity for daring to claim there is some merit to the whole mess.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 22:14:46 No.13804901 Report

Quoted By: >>13806103 >>13808598

>>13804104
>>13804264
>>13804366
OP here
I understand that bachelors =/= intelligence. That's not my concern. I'm actively researching, and have been for a decent amount of time. I'm getting pretty close to having publishable results, not as a minor contributor to something someone else writes, but actually 100% originally generated research. As in, I took the data, I (with guidance from my advisor) am coming up with the conclusions and correlations myself, because what we are doing is pretty fresh ground. We really don't know what we expect to find, so I'm digging through the data and putting together a picture myself. I'm not riding the coat tails of a supervisor or sucking up to my lab advisor, we basically just meet to bounce ideas off of each other and run my conclusions by him for a second pair of eyes, but I am writing the paper and publishing myself, as an undergraduate thesis. THIS is not something that your average coasting bachelor brainlet is doing, and I feel like this should qualify me for SOMETHING more than technician work, something remotely creative or intellectually stimulating beyond "fix machine". But despite all of that, I'm excluded from considerations solely on the grounds that I only have a bachelors.

I'd be happy to go to grad school, plenty capable, and ideally would love to some day. But I don't wanna fuck myself financially when there are major moneybags in industry and I have been (sometimes literally) starving for my entire undergrad experience. But maybe i just take a year or two working a shite industry job to save up 100-200k (single, worked through uni so no college debt, fine living on 20k a year) then go back to do something cool. Then by the time I'm 30 and out of grad school I can start to save up for a house. Fuck me.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 31 Oct 2021 11:06:44 No.13806103 Report

Quoted By:

>>13804901
Why would an employer believe your claims that you are exceptional when they could just hire someone with proof of what they have done in the form of qualifications. People in the real world do not share your opinions on the validity of random degrees

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 31 Oct 2021 12:28:59 No.13806247 Report

Quoted By: >>13807931

>>13804330
>implying algo interview isn't rote memorization
>implying 5-10 minutes interview can test if someone is good

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 31 Oct 2021 14:05:45 No.13806484 Report

Quoted By:

>>13804366
same shit for all degrees not only bs
the entirety of academia is for braindead sheep
most important research is done by a very small group of intelligent people and the rest just do "research" (*) to pretend theyre not useless

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 31 Oct 2021 14:15:29 No.13806506 Report

Quoted By: >>13806516 >>13808506 >>13808517 >>13808759

>>13804104
>dimwits who deny the importance of IQ and prefer nepotism over meritocracy
If you need to say "my number is this high" instead of "these are my accomplishments", that's the opposite of meritocracy. The reason why the second way is better is that it shows you have other desired traits. IQ is only ever useful as a tool for clinical diagnoses when somebody is on the low end. You're pretty clueless if you haven't figured this out, like >>13804572 said.

I'm gonna give you a quick rundown about getting a job, because it looks like you're dead in the water without it. First you make a CV, which is a paper that gets you an interview; that's the only thing it ever does, and it has to be designed to be skimmed in about 10 seconds because people are only ever reading the first word of each line (throw some power words in there, the goal is to make them believe that you're worth interviewing). Then you go to the interview, which is 100% about social intelligence and that begins with how you look. To ace the interview be normal and be positive; smile (the goal of the interview is to convey confidence and agreeableness, it's not about how much you know or can do). That's it, you have the job now. If you couldn't figure this our or can't do it, then you're not a genius, but retarded.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 31 Oct 2021 14:16:58 No.13806509 Report

Quoted By:

If you want to publish original research yourself, oftentimes doctoral research is the way to go. But, you don't have to put yourself in significant debt to go after one. Many companies will actually assist or entirely pay for higher degrees while you're working for them, and as a result you'll have a near-guaranteed position for when you complete your degree. If you're already doing research it's definitely worth your time. While you're working that job in industry, ask them about it. My mother did the same; She worked for an insurance company and they paid for her entire degree.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 31 Oct 2021 14:18:31 No.13806511 Report

Quoted By:

People who call research braindead really don't know how much they don't know. It's half funny, half sad. That "useless" research is what's powering your computer. Where do you think the microchip came from?

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 31 Oct 2021 14:20:07 No.13806516 Report

Quoted By:

>>13806506
Finally someone based

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 31 Oct 2021 23:12:06 No.13807931 Report

Quoted By:

>>13806247
Can you read? You literally just reiterated my points. Thanks I guess

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 31 Oct 2021 23:31:37 No.13807983 Report

Quoted By:

>>13803800
lol OP if you actually have creative drive then just start your own business/work for yourself

oh whats that? you're completely devoid of self determination and need someone to be your boss but not really? but you dont want to be a professor? hmmmm

yep you're an idiot

Anonymous

Anonymous Sun 31 Oct 2021 23:36:18 No.13807993 Report

Quoted By:

>>13803800
Escape? It's the way you finally figure out you're in it.

Academia is going down, as soon as the funding is put into question. The scientists don't understand this. Let them do their pet projects which most of them don't want to be doing until the money runs out.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 00:20:42 No.13808114 Report

Quoted By:

>>13803800
This is why you literally just lie. These people are actual retards. Get a fake PhD even.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 02:59:22 No.13808452 Report

Quoted By:

is studying 4 years and then going to work in the private sector something that doesn't exist anymore?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 03:10:02 No.13808475 Report

Quoted By:

>>13803800
>turns out everything school was promising was a big lie, the degree i got turned out to have been useless
>that means i should devote even more of my efforts to school, right?
op is a very gullible faggot

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 03:16:30 No.13808487 Report

Quoted By: >>13808556

>>13804280
It's an IQ test.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 03:25:27 No.13808506 Report

Quoted By:

>>13806506
I also add that you read the job requirements. if you dont qualify dont even think of applying
>inb4 thats obvious
yeah. for you maybe but for the retarded masses like OP, just dont be that retard who applies to 50+ jobs a day and complain no one called him even for an interview.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 03:31:11 No.13808517 Report

Quoted By: >>13808592

>>13806506
>IQ is only ever useful as a tool for clinical diagnoses when somebody is on the low end. You're pretty clueless if you haven't figured this out, like >>13804572 said.

sure, thats why the military uses them when selecting from a very large candidate pool right?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 03:41:58 No.13808536 Report

Quoted By:

>>13803800
kek
A PhD in physics isn't an escape. I got your treatment when I had a bachelor's degree but when I had a PhD suddenly I was overqualified and still just as unemployable.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 03:52:44 No.13808556 Report

Quoted By:

>>13804280
Like >>13808487 said, it's a simple IQ test to ensure you can actually understand abstract problems.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 04:14:38 No.13808579 Report

Quoted By: >>13808618

>>13804280
Not just IBM. Even investment banks like Goldman Sachs uses these tests which are not outright IQ tests but a very good indicator of intelligence. The job market still values high IQ a lot even if it is not directly said.
I guess the real dilemma for a hiring manager would be picking between a high IQ but inexperienced youngster and a low IQ but experienced middle aged person.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 04:21:23 No.13808592 Report

Quoted By: >>13808714 >>13809975

>>13808517
>sure, thats why the military uses them when selecting from a very large candidate pool right?
Exactly. If you think about it, only the dumbest in society would do the stuff soldiers do. It makes sense that you need to screen for the clinically retarded and then accept the ones that barely made it. Consider that they don't test your IQ when working for NASA or FAANG, Why would they test you in the military but not in the high-end tech jobs? Hint: It's not the high numbers they care about.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 04:25:50 No.13808598 Report

Quoted By: >>13808601

>>13804901
Employers don't care and they have are too dumb to know that you could do the same thing as a PhD could do. PhDs are a dime a dozen so it doesn't even matter to them.
If you have a research pipeline, then you have a shot of being a useful PhD in academia. The days of hiring someone on a whim that they might pay off are over. Now they want to hire the PhD in the hope that they might pay off.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 04:28:26 No.13808601 Report

Quoted By: >>13808631

>>13808598
But what about the jobs that are available only to PhDs?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 04:38:07 No.13808618 Report

Quoted By: >>13808652

>>13808579
I think the real dilemma facing hiring managers is choosing a person that has the correct temperament and is a cultural fit for the company from a group of candidates whose technical skills are more or less identical.

However, this probably is not the case for whatever entry level job you are applying for.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 04:46:27 No.13808631 Report

Quoted By:

>>13808601
They only want PhDs and don't want to pay if they don't have to.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 05:01:01 No.13808652 Report

Quoted By:

>>13808618
>However, this probably is not the case for whatever entry level job you are applying for.

Why do you think that?

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 05:04:00 No.13808656 Report

Quoted By:

>>13804104
>An IQ test and a written exam would be much better
It's not HR; that's flat out illegal under the 1965 constitution: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Griggs_v._Duke_Power_Co.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 05:48:38 No.13808714 Report

Quoted By: >>13809932

>>13808592
Dude you are vaush-tier

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 06:02:38 No.13808729 Report

Quoted By:

>>13803800
WHERE IS THIS COMPANY

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 06:21:58 No.13808742 Report

Quoted By:

>>13804268
Programming problems aren’t IQ tests; they’re a cover for random discrimination based on vibes and whether you’re the same race as the interviewer.

Anonymous

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Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 06:36:41 No.13808759 Report

Quoted By:

>>13806506
>which is 100% about social intelligence
>You're pretty clueless if you haven't figured this out
>I'm gonna give you a quick rundown about getting a job, because it looks like you're dead in the water without it.
>the goal of the interview is to convey confidence and agreeableness

https://youtu.be/vhSHXGM7kgE

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 16:58:14 No.13809932 Report

Quoted By:

>>13808714
I don't know what that is, but it's probably a bad thing that you do. Spend less time learning about that and more socializing and connecting with people.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 17:23:59 No.13809975 Report

Quoted By:

>>13808592
>they don't test your IQ when working for NASA or FAANG
They do

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 17:45:33 No.13810010 Report

Quoted By:

>>13804111
College also tests your willingness to complete complex tasks you don't enjoy doing with minimal supervision, obviously a trait desirable for any sort of office work. No one thinks writing a 10 page paper for a class you're only taking to meet requirements is fun. It's hard to test for that diligence in a 1 hour pseudo-IQ test, college GPA is a better proxy.

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 18:04:28 No.13810044 Report

Quoted By:

>>13804342
These people act like this to make you nervous and to test your stress tolerance. Had a mock interview in school once and they did similar stuff, like pulling out their phone etc

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 18:12:15 No.13810063 Report

Quoted By:

>Is a pHD the only way

No, you will never get a "creative" job unless you have already proven you have the capacity to create things. You have probably never designed something that has come to fruition, all of your accomplishments are completing practice problems from professors. This board has some seriously unhealthy expectations. What job do you want? What job would you consider "making use of your degree"?

Anonymous

Anonymous Mon 01 Nov 2021 18:21:27 No.13810084 Report

Quoted By:

the only reason to major in physics is if you are also majoring in some engineering or you are 100% sure that you are talented enough to make it to some big research and or get grants.

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