/sci/ - Science & Math » Thread #13801328

88KiB, 736x1101, that's me in the corner.jpg

View Same Google iqdb SauceNAO

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 18:43:51 2021 No.13801328 View Reply Original Report

Quoted By: >>13801569 >>13802636 >>13802701

Was Nietzsche right about eternal recurrence?

>Singularity Big Bangs
>Universe with galaxies forms
>Life finds a way
>You are born
>Universe expands until completely uniform
>Heat death
>Universe returns to Singularity
>Repeat trillions of times until the same conditions arise
>Same Universe and all events in it happen again
>You are born again
>Repeat forever

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 18:52:05 No.13801356 Report

Quoted By: >>13801504 >>13802841

nondisprovable conjectures are not science

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 19:50:46 No.13801504 Report

Quoted By: >>13801516 >>13801528 >>13802634

>>13801356
>Constantly bombarded by you scientists with "Multiverse" and "Simulation" theories presented as fact

>this is not science

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 19:56:34 No.13801516 Report

Quoted By: >>13801590

>>13801504
A philosopher eating a weird mushroom during a walk in nature doesn't qualify as a science experiment.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 20:01:11 No.13801528 Report

Quoted By: >>13801539

>>13801504
"Simulation" is a meme term used to filter brainlets. It's not the same as a hologram and shouldn't be taken literally. It's only a concept to get your head around the math.
The same goes for "multiverse"; how do you call the patches of spacetime that we can't ever hope to get info from/to? The observable 'verse' is not the whole picture.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 20:06:05 No.13801539 Report

Quoted By: >>13801553 >>13801570

>>13801528
Is there any "scientific" theory that says the Universe will collapse and restart?

How can it continue to expand forever? Wouldn't that require infinite "dark energy" to come into existence and violate conservation of energy?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 20:09:51 No.13801549 Report

Quoted By: >>13801563 >>13801597

As far as I understand it, Nietzsche did not claim and did not try to prove that the universe actually recurs eternally. It's just an existentialist tool or thought experiment.
>The greatest weight.—What, if some day or night a demon were to steal after you into your loneliest loneliness and say to you: “This life as you now live it and have lived it, you will have to live once more and innumerable times more; and there will be nothing new in it, but every pain and every joy and every thought and sigh and everything unutterably small or great in your life will have to return to you, all in the same succession and sequence—even this spider and this moonlight between the trees, and even this moment and I myself. The eternal hourglass of existence is turned upside down again and again, and you with it, speck of dust!” (The Gay Science p. 341).

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 20:10:26 No.13801553 Report

Quoted By: >>13801571

>>13801539
>How can it continue to expand forever? Wouldn't that require infinite "dark energy" to come into existence and violate conservation of energy?
We don't even know what 'dark energy' is. It could even be a fundamental law of nature in itself.
You don't say that gravity has to stop at some point because of the conservation of energy...
Such a fundamental characteristic of the WHOLE universe cannot be apprehended with regular physics.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 20:12:15 No.13801563 Report

Quoted By:

>>13801549
It's proven that Nietzche was taking large amount of narcotics and psychedelics. Basically a lot of his 'theories' are nothing more than the delirium of a precursor of the hippy movement.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 20:14:18 No.13801569 Report

Quoted By: >>13801579 >>13801597

>>13801328
>Was Nietzsche right about eternal recurrence?
He wasn't talking about it being physically true - but rather about how you should live as if it was and embrace life.

As far as the actual possibility of it - it is not known. I can show you examples of dynamical system under which the assumptions of the Poincare Recurrence Theorem are met thus it holds and situations where it doesn't hold, but even that doesn't take into account quantum mechanics/field theory and even those are not actually correct and the real answer would need a theory of everything. There is no answer here.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 20:14:25 No.13801570 Report

Quoted By:

>>13801539
Have you read about the ads/qft correspondance? it was written in 1998 so that question has already been answered long ago.
And nobody calls it conservation of energy anymore, it's about discrete information anon.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 20:15:39 No.13801571 Report

Quoted By:

>>13801553
>You don't say that gravity has to stop at some point because of the conservation of energy...

Yeah you do. Gravity is caused from mass/energy warping space. Its effects do not continue further once the finite amount of matter runs out.

But somehow the Universe is supposed to expand to infinite size for infinite time even after all matter has been stretched to its limit and there are no particles left and black holes evaporate?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 20:18:44 No.13801579 Report

Quoted By: >>13801623

>>13801569
>I can show you examples of dynamical system under which the assumptions of the Poincare Recurrence Theorem are met thus it holds and situations where it doesn't hold,
And I forgot to mention that it is a rather subtle theorem and doesn't speak about actual periodicity and rather speaks about quasi periodicity - it guarantees that given an initial state, your system is guaranteed to go back arbitrarily closely to that state and not necessarily exhibit perfect periodicity. It also says nothing about the timescales involved in such recurrence - they may be astronomically large.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 20:21:50 No.13801590 Report

Quoted By:

>>13801516
why not?

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 20:23:35 No.13801597 Report

Quoted By: >>13801623

>>13801549
>>13801569
It's true. Why do you think Nietzsche was trying so hard to lose his virginity? Because he'd be stuck as a virgin forever in a repeating universe if he didn't.

Anonymous

Anonymous Fri 29 Oct 2021 20:32:14 No.13801623 Report

Quoted By:

>>13801579
If you want a resource to learn more - check Arnolds Classical Mechanics book, he has an excellent writeup on it. Its not particularly hard to understand, but it has subtle nuances to it and is pretty damn general, but still limitted to the case of classical phase spaces. There do exist generalizations of it for ordinary QM and for some other cases(ergodic theorem) and I suggest you also learn those.
>>13801597
Whatever his personal motivations were, he formulated it pretty damn eloquently.

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 04:34:01 No.13802634 Report

Quoted By:

>>13801504
>>presented as fact

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 04:35:03 No.13802636 Report

Quoted By:

>>13801328
>>>/lit/

Anonymous

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 05:16:57 No.13802701 Report

Quoted By:

>>13801328
“A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything.”
--Nietzsche

Anonymous

View Same Google iqdb SauceNAO hollow.jpg, 54KiB, 500x500

Anonymous Sat 30 Oct 2021 06:42:50 No.13802841 Report

Quoted By:

>>13801356
i didn't ask if it was science or not, i asked if he was right or not

Capcode	All Only User Posts Only Moderator Posts Only Admin Posts Only Developer Posts
Show Posts	All Only With Images Only Without Images
Deleted Posts	All Only Deleted Posts Only Non-Deleted Posts
Ghost Posts	All Only Ghost Posts Only Non-Ghost Posts
Post Type	All Only Sticky Threads Only Opening Posts Only Reply Posts
Results	All Grouped By Threads
Order	Latest Posts First Oldest Posts First

Your latest searches